Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Building a weapon? Have a new design or helpful hint you would like to share? Please ask advice or give advice here!

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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Cassius » Mon Jul 26, 2010 7:28 pm

"Otherwise unarmed peasants" would modify the blade so that it resembled the war scythe, which is probably how it was invented.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Spiderling » Tue Jul 27, 2010 3:31 am

[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]Thankfully,I got my friend who is in woodshop to get into the game, and he is willing to make the shape of one in wood in exchange for me padding his weapons. I figured this would be the best method instead of dealing with PVC joints and the like.[/quote]He's gonna make you a wooden scythe to put foam on?
That's gonna break right quick.
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The opinions expressed in this post do not necessarily represent those of anyone with any common sense whatsoever.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Arrakis » Tue Jul 27, 2010 8:06 am

[quote="Casimir Glassjaw"]
"Otherwise unarmed peasants" would modify the blade so that it resembled the war scythe, which is probably how it was invented.
[/quote]

Or else they probably used, oh, I don't know, their woodcutting axe, or their shovel, sharpened, or their sling they use to hunt squirrels, or their brush ax, or their adz, or their mattock, or or or or...
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby ChomperTheSharptooth » Tue Jul 27, 2010 9:34 am

Out of those tools though this would be the most recognizable, like I doubt my friends would get the difference between a woodcutting axe and one used for battle. That coupled with it being somthing I'd like to use, its almost like wielding a blue sword, only it is displaced far enough from the body to place shots you'd only get by taking a hit. It breaking down is a legitimate problem. My (wooden) hockey stick experiment has held up fine for months of weekly skirmishes but it is curved the wrong way so maybe it is more fragile with a proper blade?
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Milo Baines » Tue Jul 27, 2010 9:53 am

do it it'll be awesome and perfect and work so much better than anyone thinks... ;)
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Cidahre Daland » Tue Jul 27, 2010 10:36 am

What about the maccabees.  When they were raided and had to fight one on one (which they didn't do often).  They used shovels, axes, slings and other farming tools to fight, because they lacked real weapons.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby ChomperTheSharptooth » Tue Jul 27, 2010 10:13 pm

Thanks guys, are there any suggestions to make this more durable? I'm pretty set on a wood head at least, bending anything else to that shape could be bad. I thought of screwing it to a PVC pipe thought, could this make it hold up any longer? I've used and made both PVC weapons and wood weapons, but having never screwed one to the other I'm weary of this idea.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Kyron McFallon » Thu Jul 29, 2010 9:26 pm

Arrakis, i agree, but chillax remember you were a newb at one point to. We all have questions and i have to say it really is not that hard to be assertive w/out being blatantly disrespectful to some one who obviously does not have your experience. And Chomper.... it wont work. Im sorry but they are right just dont do it some one WILL get hurt
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Garret Ironshield » Thu Jul 29, 2010 9:34 pm

He doesn't need experience to read.

There is at least one scythe question on every page.

Ripped from what was the base of this thread "Experimental Weapons FAQ" (http://www.dagorhir.com/forums/http://w ... ic.php?t=7):

Question 12.  Can I make a scythe?
Answer. This is a real favorite question for newer fighters.  The honest answer is that there's nothing in the rules which prevents anyone from using a scythe.  Lots of us would love to see one.  However, in a practical sense, a scythe presents an absurd number of construction difficulties.  I've made tons of weapons, but the thought of making one frightens me.
The basic problem is that the blade is perpendicular to the haft.  Mounting it on there is not as easy as you might think.  Whatever method is used, especially if it's one involving PVC joints, would snap very quickly.  I don't see a weapon like this lasting for much beyond a battle or two.
The second construction problem involves making that point safe.  The end of that scythe moves at a very good clip because of all the torque.  Given that it's tough enough to make safe stabbing points for spears, making a safe scythe-end is really intimidating.
All I can say on this one is "trust me."  Don't make a scythe one of your first projects.  Work with weapons and figure things out for a while - say, a good year.  If by that time you're not aghast at the prospect of making a foam scythe, by all means go ahead and make one.  And be sure to tell me how you made it work.
Extra Credit - What would the point on a scythe count as?  Green or red?
Answer.  Good question.  Many of you are probably wondering why you even need to ask - it's a big sharp pointy thing, so obviously it's green, right?
Wrong.  Although this topic has been occasionally debated, the majority of Dagorhir veterans would tell you that the point of the weapon is red, assuming the weapon is over 3' long.
Dagorhir weapons are not their real-life counterparts.  They're foam.  And the Dagorhir rules are simplified so that the class of a weapon is mostly dependent upon the way in which it hits you.  A swung weapon is either blue or red.  A thrust weapon is green.  A missile weapon with a 'point' on it is yellow.  There's no such thing as a swung green any more than there is a thrust red.  The same logic works for little "points" at the tail ends of hammers or axes.
Finally, the concept of a swung green just makes the rules confusing.  On a long weapon like a scythe, it's a disadvantage to the wielder.  (If swung one-handed, it would do nothing against armor.  If swung two-handed, it wouldn't break shields.)  On a short weapon, it's a way to cheese the rules and make a small armor-penetrating weapon.  (Goes through armor with 2 hands, even though it does nothing with one hand.)  With a system designed for quick combat, the confusion added with a swung green weapon just muddies the waters.  Realism takes a back seat to playability.
If you're not convinced it's confusing, imagine a mace with four faces.  The maker's determined two of the sides are "spikes" and thus do green damage.  The other two sides are blue just like a normal weapon.  Do you really want to worry about which side hit you in the heat of battle?


See? Actually reading the first post of the thread, that comes with links, actually helps.

/scythe discussion.
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[/quote]
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Arrakis » Fri Jul 30, 2010 7:45 am

[quote="Azrion Greenwolf"]
Arrakis, i agree, but chillax remember you were a newb at one point to. We all have questions and i have to say it really is not that hard to be assertive w/out being blatantly disrespectful to some one who obviously does not have your experience. And Chomper.... it wont work. Im sorry but they are right just dont do it some one WILL get hurt
[/quote]

I ain't tryin'a hate.  Read my post with more of a sarcastic/ridiculous tone, as though I find it funny/outlandish to be saying what I'm saying but still meaning it.  Some people apparently think I'm really an *******; Not so!  I'm just prone to hyperbole.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Sven Kolfinsson » Fri Jul 30, 2010 9:12 am

Azrion, if you didn't giggle when you read Arrakis' post, you read it wrong. :)
Disirregardlessly hivemind wrote:
Sven Kolfinsson wrote:...it worked pretty good until a side fell.

tl;dr: the history of warfare :)

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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Kyron McFallon » Fri Jul 30, 2010 9:27 pm

Sorry, Typing hides tones  i see now sorry Arrakis
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby ChomperTheSharptooth » Fri Jul 30, 2010 9:51 pm

I thought I was doing the right thing when I drew up a sketch and tried to explain how I planned to build it. So far every search for scythe is a 'how do I make one?' or 'are they legal?' question. I wanted feedback specifically on my design and all it did was stir up resentment of the topic (which I'd honestly have too if I saw it come up this much) but in a game where a man where's a barrel as a shield and we can use completely inaccurate (in a historical sense) Klingon weapons my real life tool wouldn't be so far fetched (if there were a working design).

The recent consensus seems to be I failed, and I'm glad I'm now seen as illeterate and unwilling to look through the myriad of other scythe topics. I tried to contribute a design; one I would've made by now instead of posting an idea of if I wasn't a jobless student in a family that still gets foodstamps until the first paycheck for my dad's new job comes in. I get it, it would hurt, now if that could have been the first thing said instead of why a scythe wouldn't be used in a real-life combat scenario then I would know my idea is a bust. Nobody has given DrunkenBob's laughable arsenal the same judgement, and I use this to explain why I kept pushing my design- DrunkenBob is simply the only man to come to mind (I seriously wish I had his creativity)

And as funny as Arrakis's post was for others to read, its exaggeration detracted from some of its meaning. It's hard to take his reccomendations seriously when telling me to shut up and calling me an idiot. As for Garret, I did read the first post, I read almost every topic that came up in a search for 'scythe' after reading that first post. That is what made me decide to do this. I wanted to try to find some way to build a scythe that could have some utility and could stop all the other noobie questions about it, but clearly the little effort I put in to solving this problem is wasted because my idea wouldn't work and thus puts me on the level of the ignorant and the lazy. I wanted to stop posting after Arrakis, I was actually hurt a little that I was recieving more criticism than my plan, but then someone had to come and show me what I have read numerous times because it was obvious I couldn't have glanced upon the first post of the topic I posted in.

I'm sorry, but I cannot believe how much of a ruckus one stupid question generated.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Wraithe » Fri Jul 30, 2010 9:56 pm

1. DB's barrel shield isnt a danger to anyone but himself lol.
2.  Dag has been around since 1978 if it could be done, it would of been by now.
3.  Not to mention after a while everyone got tired of politely saying dont do it, which if you read the forums you would of saw that, so why not have fun with it.  If the same bum keeps asking me for change after a while im gonna mess with him for my own personal enjoyment.  Its good to be creative but focus on something that is already proven.  work on different designs for a sword or axe.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Garret Ironshield » Fri Jul 30, 2010 10:07 pm

I didn't mean offense; I was trying to point out that there were other who posed the same questions you did. It's been pitched to us before, a rather-new guy says in essence "I want to make a scythe." (Sometimes we get lucky and chance upon a person who says it sincerely.)

It would be a whole different situation if you had made the scythe already and said:

"Hey guys, I've recently constructed a scythe and I have used it on the battlefield. I have come to the conclusion that ______ (Works/Doesn't work.) (We'll say it did.)

I have a lot of success on the field with it, and though it is impractical, I find that it just has a large learning curve. So far, I haven't injured anyone with it. I will post progress as I make it.

[PICS of the weapon and PICS of Weapon in action.]

Thoughts? I knew this would be received badly if I didn't test it first so I tested it before coming to show you [like it said in the first post]."

And on a side note:

DB special in silly weapons. His barrel shield conforms to all the needed specifications and he admits it wasn't supposed to be effective, just silly. He even has a vid of him being ineffective. It's for laughs. Everybody knows it, so they take it lightly.

A scythe on the other hand is serious. Not for giggles. So people tend to take it seriously.

Also:

You should probably listen to Arrakis' advice. He gives sound advice when you get past the douchebaggery.

Once again, no offense.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Dragonwalker » Fri Jul 30, 2010 10:11 pm

[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]
I thought I was doing the right thing when I drew up a sketch and tried to explain how I planned to build it. So far every search for scythe is a 'how do I make one?' or 'are they legal?' question. I wanted feedback specifically on my design and all it did was stir up resentment of the topic (which I'd honestly have too if I saw it come up this much) but in a game where a man where's a barrel as a shield and we can use completely inaccurate (in a historical sense) Klingon weapons my real life tool wouldn't be so far fetched (if there were a working design).

The recent consensus seems to be I failed, and I'm glad I'm now seen as illeterate and unwilling to look through the myriad of other scythe topics. I tried to contribute a design; one I would've made by now instead of posting an idea of if I wasn't a jobless student in a family that still gets foodstamps until the first paycheck for my dad's new job comes in. I get it, it would hurt, now if that could have been the first thing said instead of why a scythe wouldn't be used in a real-life combat scenario then I would know my idea is a bust. Nobody has given DrunkenBob's laughable arsenal the same judgement, and I use this to explain why I kept pushing my design- DrunkenBob is simply the only man to come to mind (I seriously wish I had his creativity)

And as funny as Arrakis's post was for others to read, its exaggeration detracted from some of its meaning. It's hard to take his reccomendations seriously when telling me to shut up and calling me an idiot. As for Garret, I did read the first post, I read almost every topic that came up in a search for 'scythe' after reading that first post. That is what made me decide to do this. I wanted to try to find some way to build a scythe that could have some utility and could stop all the other noobie questions about it, but clearly the little effort I put in to solving this problem is wasted because my idea wouldn't work and thus puts me on the level of the ignorant and the lazy. I wanted to stop posting after Arrakis, I was actually hurt a little that I was recieving more criticism than my plan, but then someone had to come and show me what I have read numerous times because it was obvious I couldn't have glanced upon the first post of the topic I posted in.

I'm sorry, but I cannot believe how much of a ruckus one stupid question generated.
[/quote][quote="Casimir Glassjaw"]
The obvious design flaw of trying to make a scythe is the first thing that comes to mind.
Some advice, leave the farming tools at home and make a real weapon.

[img width=500 height=596]http://sworddueling.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/scythemen.jpg[/img]
Scythe made for battle.

[img width=448 height=336]http://archive.energyfarms.net/files/user32/Jason_Cutting_Cover_crop.jpg[/img]
Scythe made for wheat.
[/quote]


Chomper, if your wanting to make a scythe that would work for battle, why not make a war scythe like the top picture that Casimir posted? It'd be a single edged glaive with a slight curve. That would probably work, as long as you did it correctly. Could even be a red, or a blue, with a stabbing tip. That's my two cents if your totally deadset on this.

Before doing that though, I'd say to knock out a sword, an axe, a dagger, and a mace first. Make sure the sword has a stabby tip, and that they are all safe. That should help quite a bit if you are new, short on cash, and need practice at smithing.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby ChomperTheSharptooth » Fri Jul 30, 2010 10:26 pm

I've had a few designs I've wantd to try, and I can guarantee a bunch will break instantly. I know some will work for a little while, and I hope at least one is on par with my other weapons. I will lack these tools indefinitely, depending on when I get a call back from one of the many places I've filled an application out for. You're right, I did forego that part, and I should have known a wooden hocky stick padded the same way would still be far less dangrous than a scythe designed with the same materials.

I'm sorry about this all, I should have been patient and waited for me to have money instead of saying what I intend to do when I get it. I *will* make a thread in that point in time, detailing my success or failure for others.

As for Dragonwalker, I have made all of those weapons, save the glaive/war scythe. There have been people to make kama's and pick type weapons so a scythe surely isn't *impossible* to design. And before anyone sends me to the new thread in the fighting section about scythe fighting, I just looked at it, as funny as it looks I've fought a lot like that with my hockey stick/prototype scythe. XD

Thank you all for the responses, I now feel a little more obligated to bring something to the site- be it a farming tool or a different beast entirely.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Cassius » Fri Jul 30, 2010 10:53 pm

[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]
I thought I was doing the right thing when I drew up a sketch and tried to explain how I planned to build it.[/quote]
Except a plan exactly like that has been discussed before.  Are you really so naive to think that you would come up with a new and safe way to make a weapon that has seldom seen successful builds in the 30+ years of this games function?
[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]So far every search for scythe is a 'how do I make one?' or 'are they legal?' question. I wanted feedback specifically on my design[/quote]
And yet you didn't read why people previously have said that scythe designs fail?
[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]and all it did was stir up resentment of the topic (which I'd honestly have too if I saw it come up this much)[/quote]
Patience tends to wear thin when every newbie thinks that their favorite Gundam's weapon would make a great boffer, especially when they insist that they can do it right when told otherwise.
[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]but in a game where a man where's a barrel as a shield and we can use completely inaccurate (in a historical sense)[/quote]
Two completely different mindsets there though.  DB took the rules and said, "What is something ridiculous I can do that follows all of the rules?  I know, a shield that curves around my entire body!"  He also has been playing this game for many years.  He is fully aware of what a safe build is and how to make it.
You are new and lack the experience that he has, plus, you are not making this to parody the rules.  It seems like you are trying to make this to A) try to prove everybody wrong and/or B) because you think scythes are the coolest weapon EVAR!
[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]Klingon weapons[/quote]
Except they fail for being double ended weapons that are not cylindrical.  Sorry, no go there.
[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]my real life tool wouldn't be so far fetched (if there were a working design).[/quote]
Exactly, if there was a working design.
[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]The recent consensus seems to be I failed, and I'm glad I'm now seen as illeterate and unwilling to look through the myriad of other scythe topics.[/quote]
First off, you spelled illiterate wrong.  Second, just to further my point that I do not believe you did properly search the forums before posting this:
http://www.dagorhir.com/forums/http://w ... 99#p298399
http://www.dagorhir.com/forums/http://w ... ic.php?t=4
http://www.dagorhir.com/forums/http://w ... 763#p55763
http://www.dagorhir.com/forums/http://w ... 748#p55748
http://www.dagorhir.com/forums/http://w ... 771#p91771
Every one of those posts has some element that is relevant to your design.  It took me less then two minutes to dig all of these up.  I searched for "scythe wood".
[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]I tried to contribute a design; one I would've made by now instead of posting an idea of[/quote]
[img width=427 height=640]http://www.ntsc-uk.com/reviews/nds/PhoenixWrightGyakutenSaiban/03.jpg[/img]
So when you said, and I quote:
I thought I was doing the right thing when I drew up a sketch and tried to explain how I planned to build it.

What you meant was that you didn't have the resources at the time, and if you did, you never would have posted and just build it instead?  Thus, not doing "the right thing".
[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]if I wasn't a jobless student in a family that still gets foodstamps until the first paycheck for my dad's new job comes in.[/quote]
The pity card?  Really?  Well let me tell you right now, it isn't going to work on me, because I assure you that I am more poor then you are.  Sorry.
[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]I get it, it would hurt, now if that could have been the first thing said instead of why a scythe wouldn't be used in a real-life combat scenario then I would know my idea is a bust.[/quote]
So we are supposed to assume you will listen to that detail when you and most others don't listen to any other detail or reasoning as to why a scythe is a bad idea?  I thought you said something like:
and all it did was stir up resentment of the topic (which I'd honestly have too if I saw it come up this much)

[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]
Nobody has given DrunkenBob's laughable arsenal the same judgement, and I use this to explain why I kept pushing my design- DrunkenBob is simply the only man to come to mind (I seriously wish I had his creativity)[/quote]
How about you read some of the threads where he gets the ideas for his weapons.  Things might start to clear up about this if you do.
[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]
And as funny as Arrakis's post was for others to read, its exaggeration detracted from some of its meaning. It's hard to take his reccomendations seriously when telling me to shut up and calling me an idiot.[/quote]
His statements were likely influenced entirely by your previous posts.
[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]As for Garret, I did read the first post, I read almost every topic that came up in a search for 'scythe' after reading that first post. That is what made me decide to do this.[/quote]
Your posts do not reflect this.
[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]I wanted to try to find some way to build a scythe that could have some utility and could stop all the other noobie questions about it,[/quote]
Except you approached this as a noob with a noob mentality.  If someone who had been playing the game for many years said "Hey guys, I am going to give making a scythe a shot," then people will more likely be like, "Alright, I want to see this."  When someone wants to build a scythe right off the bat, people are going to be like, "No, you are going to hurt someone."  This isn't exclusive to noobs wanting to build scythes, it pretty much applies to any weapon other then a basic blue sword that they want to make.
[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]but clearly the little effort I put in to solving this problem is wasted because my idea wouldn't work and thus puts me on the level of the ignorant and the lazy.[/quote]
No, your "little effort" is what put you on the level of ignorant and lazy.  Stop trying to play the victim.
[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]I wanted to stop posting after Arrakis, I was actually hurt a little that I was recieving more criticism than my plan,[/quote]
Welcome to the internet.
[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]but then someone had to come and show me what I have read numerous times because it was obvious I couldn't have glanced upon the first post of the topic I posted in.[/quote]
Again, doesn't seem like you did based on your post.  And people post without reading the first post all the time, it isn't that far fetched to assume that someone who posts a question about something explained in the first post did not read it, regardless of any more details or inquiries are attached to it.
[quote="ChomperTheSharptooth"]I'm sorry, but I cannot believe how much of a ruckus one stupid question generated.
[/quote]
Underlined the important part of that statement.  Also, this isn't a ruckus.
[img width=100 height=100]http://moderateleft.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/boondocks-uncle-ruckus-100x100.jpg[/img]
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Arrakis » Fri Jul 30, 2010 11:07 pm

Look, I ain' mean to mess you all up and isht, but scythes KEEP comin' up on the boards, no one has ever built one that worked, passed, and didn't insta-break, it's a bad idea that needs to STOP coming up, it's hard to fight with, and there's no good reason to use one.

We're stone-cold just trying to help.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Whisper Moonson » Fri Jul 30, 2010 11:15 pm

I can think of one way to make a scythe core that would work and wouldn't break, but it involves steel tubing and a welder. And since we don't allow metal cores (and this would structurally be the core, at least in part), my idea wouldn't work.

The hockey stick is probably the closest thing to workable for a scythe core, but it won't last long, and it's not a very satisfactory design - not convincingly scythe-like.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Quorren » Sun Aug 01, 2010 10:11 am

The only type of scythe I could see being built reasonably is a kama, (hand sickle.) But that's because you could construct it pretty similarly to some axes. And getting even a slight curve would still be tough. I would suggest that if you are really bent on a scythe, make a few standard weapons first to get a feel for it and then maybe try a kama, (keeping the tip wider than it really would be for obvious reasons.) Plus, this thing http://www.okinawankarateclub.com/weapons/kama.htm would be far more practical.
Last edited by Quorren on Sun Aug 01, 2010 10:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Lightningspirit » Tue Aug 17, 2010 6:39 am

One idea for a weapon is a fist weapon. This idea is simpler than the cloak on the website! All you do is get duct tape, make a fingerless glove that covers part of your wrist (cut strip of duct tape twice as big as your wrist, connect ends, add wrap(more tape) until you feel no sticky),then finish, fasten foam, and...... done!
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Dragonwalker » Tue Aug 17, 2010 7:09 am

Desveaux, I'm going to go ahead and do this nicely so more people won't eat you alive. Cuz you just jumped into the water with a naked girl on her period, in the middle of about a hundred tiger sharks. Seriously.


Fist weapon? Please tell me that your joking. Please. Because plain and simple, it says in the rules that fist weapons are not allowed. They aren't because of the safety issue, to my knowledge. Probably playability as well. Think of it like this:

"Hey, that guy just punched someone. It looks like he's wearing a hockey glove with some tape on it. I don't have tape, but I've got a hockey glove. So I can punch people! Awesome! Hey, they aren't taking my punches, and are trying to call me for doing something illegal. Well, I'll just punch harder so they'll take the hit! Wait, he has a fist weapon? But I have a hockey glove too!"

Now, also think about the safety. What do you think would hurt worse? A punch? Or a weapon strike? Lets see.......punch. I'd say punch. You take ALL of the energy that's transferred and diffused through the weapon, jam it ALL into the very small area of your hand, and shove THAT into someone's gut. Hmm....lemme think......NO. FAIL. DON"T DO IT. PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF THE GODS, AND WHATEVER YOU HOLD HOLY OR UNHOLY, DON'T FRAKKING DO IT!!!!


And yes. That was the nice version. I will now wait for Arrakis or Magnus or hivemind or someone else to turn you into pudding.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Lightningspirit » Tue Aug 17, 2010 7:13 am

Can you make a double bladed weapon?
                                              8) ;D
                                            -----}-{-----                     
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Dragonwalker » Tue Aug 17, 2010 7:19 am

Have you read the rules? Yes, you can make a double bladed weapon. It's basically going to turn out like a quarterstaff, as it has to have at least 18 inches of cylindrical padding for the striking surfaces. Please, just go read the rules before someone comes along and tries to eviscerate you with your smiley faces.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Arrakis » Tue Aug 17, 2010 7:33 am

Incredibly obvious yet still somehow successful troll is incredibly obvious yet still somehow successful.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Dragonwalker » Tue Aug 17, 2010 7:35 am

I would prefer a troll asking about weapons to a spambot asking about hotels. Either way, I fell for it. *facepalm*


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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Cassius » Wed Aug 18, 2010 7:18 pm

First problem with your request, Arrakis isn't a troll.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Dragonwalker » Wed Aug 18, 2010 7:50 pm

???

Wait. Did you just call me a troll?
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Cassin » Wed Aug 18, 2010 9:14 pm

As far as I can tell, the only person anyone tried to call "troll" is desveaux.  I'd have to agree, 90% certainty.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Micou » Thu Aug 19, 2010 12:23 am

i built one when i first started my group because i thought the same thing as Chomper,... however i still have mine and use it alot, i was afraid though that it wouldnt pass,... so i asked a buddy from the black tower(well he used to be in it lol) who had been in dag awhile and been through the whole weapons checking prosses many times,... and he seemed to think it was fine.  what i did was use a jig saw to cut out my scyth head out of a sheet of veneer pressboard NOT PLYWOOD, then for my shaft i used a 1" by 1" oak stake about 5' long. i used a band saw to split it down the middle cutting out enough room for the head but not enough that it would flop around or not soo little that it would strech the wood. then i used a brad nail gun to keep the head in place. then the foaming prosses begun it took me awhile but after a couple of days of foaming youll find that the curve in the blade gets cut down alot by the layers of foam soo even if you did get it around someones leg for instance, it would just slip right off, in the end it cought about as much as any battle axe would

then again i am still new to this to i was just sayin how i did it
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Quorren » Thu Aug 19, 2010 12:34 am

[quote="Micou"]
i built one when i first started my group because i thought the same thing as Chomper,... however i still have mine and use it alot, i was afraid though that it wouldnt pass,... so i asked a buddy from the black tower(well he used to be in it lol) who had been in dag awhile and been through the whole weapons checking prosses many times,... and he seemed to think it was fine.  what i did was use a jig saw to cut out my scyth head out of a sheet of veneer pressboard NOT PLYWOOD, then for my shaft i used a 1" by 1" oak stake about 5' long. i used a band saw to split it down the middle cutting out enough room for the head but not enough that it would flop around or not soo little that it would strech the wood. then i used a brad nail gun to keep the head in place. then the foaming prosses begun it took me awhile but after a couple of days of foaming youll find that the curve in the blade gets cut down alot by the layers of foam soo even if you did get it around someones leg for instance, it would just slip right off, in the end it cought about as much as any battle axe would

then again i am still new to this to i was just sayin how i did it
[/quote]

Eh, I don't like the fact that it uses a nail in the striking surface. As far as I know, screws and the like are reserved for acceesories and shields, (only then when they do not stick out of anything and when done with caution.) If it holds up well, kudos on the design. But the nail might be a safety hazard if/when it does break. Imagine the head snapping off, (all weapons are doomed to break eventually and a scythe can do so very... dramatically? )Anyway, imagine the nail now sticking out past the foam and swinging around. It is a possibility that I wouldn't gamble if it was me.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Sir Mirelle of Narnia » Thu Aug 19, 2010 12:38 am

[quote="Micou"]
then i used a brad nail gun to keep the head in place.

[/quote]

This alone would fail the weapon. Weapons are not supposed to have any metal in the blade part of the core, the only exception is aluminum shafted arrows.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Micou » Thu Aug 19, 2010 12:42 am

yeah i see what u mean but the way the brad nails were positioned they werent even on the blade just the shaft, and im not trying to argue sublantics though im just saying,... oh and brad nails are only 1/4" long so if it did break where the lil nails were they wouldnt stick out
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Arrakis » Thu Aug 19, 2010 8:43 am

If you didn't break something with a pressboard head in a couple of swings, we can unilaterally state that you hit like a two month-old dandelion.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Micou » Thu Aug 19, 2010 3:44 pm

its probably not like the press board your thinkin of  this press board is as strong end to end as any solid board now side to side its isnt but you dont swing a sword side to side or anything ele for that matter, what really makes it strong is the fact that it is veneered. where i used to work we built what are calld flang covers  out of the stuff. the hole perpose of these was to not buckle under pressure, and they didnt.  i even built a battle axe out of it. now i did break it but not the press board. the 1'by2' solid oak hand snapped and the veneered pressboard was fine
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Quorren » Wed Aug 25, 2010 5:43 pm

Hey wait a minute, isn't particle board just a type of press board made of sawdust and wood chips? That, I think, would make it wood...
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Fayne Erving » Wed Aug 25, 2010 8:56 pm

I am having such a hard time following anything resembling conversation due to the complete disregard for simple spelling and grammar. Somewhere some poor string of bridges is missing its string of trolls. There are scores of village people enjoying a toll free crossing.

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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Micou » Thu Aug 26, 2010 12:29 am

[quote="Quorren"]
Hey wait a minute, isn't particle board just a type of press board made of sawdust and wood chips? That, I think, would make it wood...
[/quote]
and that is a problem? i have seen just as much PVC bust in the short time i have been in dag.

oh and if you guys are talking to me about the spelling i am sorry, i never could spell, and grammar i never even tried lol
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Cassin » Thu Aug 26, 2010 1:15 am

I think there's too much prejudice against wood here.  Perhaps it has something to do with the prevalence of crappy wood, or perhaps it has something to do with the outlawing of axe handles, or maybe something to do with some kind of wood-strengthening workmanship that I've never heard of but have seen the results of.  But if a piece of PVC pipe and a hickory stick of the same dimensions got in a fight,the PVC would lose every time.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Micou » Thu Aug 26, 2010 1:41 am

thank you, im glad someone else saw that as clearly as i did
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Quorren » Thu Aug 26, 2010 3:13 am

I don't think it is a matter of wood being weak, (quite the opposite,) but of wood being hard. I mean, metal would be the core least liable to snap but also it is the most dangerous. The issue is safety. Try getting hit with a pvc pipe, then get with with a hickory dowel of the same thickness. The wood is going to hurt worse.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Whisper Moonson » Thu Aug 26, 2010 8:34 am

No. It's not prejudice (pre-judging). This is experience. My decades-long experience says that wooden weapon cores (even ash hockey sticks) WILL end up breaking, and PVC cores MAY end up breaking. Furthermore, when wood breaks, it tends to do so with long, sharp, pointy bits. That's why you have to cover it in strapping tape before you put on the foam. For our purposes, wood is very weak, even relative to PVC. Each has a different kind of weakness. That's why so many people put them together (wood inside of PVC), so the strengths of each cancel out the weaknesses of the other.

Regarding particle board being "just wood," that's not true. It's little bits of wood held together by glue. It's the wooden equivalent of felt. There are no consistent fibers that run the length of the piece. Wood gets its strength from the fibers that run all the way through it. Plywood is even stronger because the plys alternate directions, giving you fibers going both ways. Particle board, chip board, and fiberboard are small bits of wood and sawdust held together with glue. Glue is the only thing holding it together. It's great at resisting compression, but it's extremely weak against flexion and shear, which are the kind of stresses you get in a weapon core.

To put it very simply: It's going to break. Soon.

If you want to play with something flat (like for a shield or a scythe blade), spring the extra few cents per square foot and get some plywood or plastic. If you want a weapon core that'll last, get fiberglass or slip a hardwood dowel snugly into PVC.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Cassin » Thu Aug 26, 2010 10:23 am

Now I'm gonna have to go make an ironwood-cored club.  This will be time-consuming.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Fayne Erving » Wed Sep 08, 2010 4:58 pm

I love you whisper
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Quorren » Thu Nov 04, 2010 7:52 pm

[quote="Gilarc"]
Now I'm gonna have to go make an ironwood-cored club.  This will be time-consuming.
[/quote]

Gilarc, you ever make that bad boy?
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Damian Seleucus » Mon May 16, 2011 7:49 pm

Well, I was thinking, maybe, FALX!!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falx
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Garret Ironshield » Mon May 16, 2011 7:59 pm

[quote="Sven Kolfinsson"]
This is going to be the best winter EVER.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Drake Twinblade » Wed Jun 22, 2011 11:04 am

[quote="Gra'm"]
At a practice of a local unit(Militia)and a few others, a few days ago someone happened to bring a monstrosity of a maul with a foam block at least a foot in diameter. These are the appx. dimensions going off of what I remember. 4.5 feet in length, with a 1 ft. diameter striking surface with a weight of at least 10-15 lbs. Is that dag legal? If so I am greatly excited for even though it is slower than any weapon on the field when you lay a blow on an opponent with that thing, they felt it.
[/quote]

Legal and safe. But a real pain to get used to wielding.
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Re: Experimental Weapons Meta-Guide

Postby Drake Twinblade » Wed Jun 22, 2011 11:06 am

Yes, I know your post is really old.
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