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[athelas]

Tubs are great. Also leaving a change of clothes in the car is good. But definitely get tubs. Even if the tent drowns, your garb will be dry.

[Fiaren]

Just because you saw it in a video game doesn't mean it's garb.

[Azgarehta]

I do have a problem being a D-Bag stranger and harassing someone about their garb. I'd rather introduce myself and then harass them. That way I'm no longer a stranger.

[Orrin None-son]

[joke]So, if they do not follow rules and wear garb at events, I don't have to follow rules and pad weapons I hit them with, right?[/joke]

[Azriel Draconis]

i agree....
 soon as i learn to sew... I shall have period pants. My thermal im keepin but ill throw a tunic, belt, and braces on it...


 hey i get cold easy... Especially when my tankard is empty...  Like it is now...

[Goats Kordatar]

Just because it's way too big for you, doesn't mean it's garb.

An oversized polo shirt is not a tunic; it's an oversized polo shirt. Granted, not as heinous as some other examples, but still.

[Syre Jari Kafghan the Dark Knight]

[joke]So, if they do not follow rules and wear garb at events, I don't have to follow rules and pad weapons I hit them with, right?[/joke]

I am considering this more and more these days.

[Azgarehta]

Grappling is still legal, and its not our fault they happened to get grappled into a lake.

[Sir Mirelle of Narnia]

Just because it's a t-shirt that has a Dagorhir event on it, doesn't means it's garb

[Syr Olaf]

'Cause I'm a horrible heartless bitch who wants to ruin your fun!

This is the best line of in this post.

A good investment:

Just wanted to reinforce this. I have always camped out of tubs and have never had to deal with wet clothes or garb. These things will save your life, and your wardrobe.

Yes Yes yes....This has saved Otlinden i many times when our tent sprung a leak. Rag 13 tornado weather and rag 24 when the Ravens nest had an indoor pool.

[hivemind]

I require all my guys to pack in totes for campouts.

On topic: Just because you're wearing armor does not mean what you're wearing under it is garb.

[Stellaria]

Nor does it mean that you don't need garb under it.

[Alric]

Breaking the formula a little bit, but:

Just because we aren't the SCA doesn't mean you don't need garb.

Whenever a serious conversation about garb standards starts, someone invariably says, 'well, we aren't the SCA!'* Of course we aren't, we're Dagorhir. And Dagorhir requires garb. Telling people who call you out for breaking the rules by wearing a tshirt onto the field that they should go join the SCA doesn't change the fact that Dagorhir's rules have a minimum dress code.

And the SCA isn't a history geek paradise - it's a bunch of nerds, some of whom like history, some of whom like to dress up in pickle barrel armor. That is, they're just like us, only bigger, a little richer, and generally more pseudo-historical. If you want to use 'Quit Dagorhir, go play ______ instead' argument, tell people to join a living history group. They're the people who make everyone wear real historical stuff. The SCA doesn't.

* (This rant isn't aimed at your recent comments, Athelas; I know you weren't using the SCA thing to justify illegal stuff. Others do though, and this rant is aimed at them.)

[Genz]

Just because you're a girl a skirt doesn't make a tank top garb
it's just never garb

Meh this one I don't really see a point of bringing up and really arguing. I can go and fight without a shirt on, or just in general be at an event. A female cannot. If a girl wants to wear a solid color tank top I'm not going to stress over it. Is it garb in a traditional sense? No, but does it fit a niche? Yes. There is always the argument of well you can always get _____ instead, but if that really doesn't seem to hold water given that it is in the extremes of temp. There can be considerations made can there not?

[Solusar]

I require all my guys to pack in totes for campouts.

On topic: Just because you're wearing armor does not mean what you're wearing under it is garb.

So?

[Alric]

Just because you're a girl a skirt doesn't make a tank top garb
it's just never garb

Meh this one I don't really see a point of bringing up and really arguing. I can go and fight without a shirt on, or just in general be at an event. A female cannot. If a girl wants to wear a solid color tank top I'm not going to stress over it. Is it garb in a traditional sense? No, but does it fit a niche? Yes. There is always the argument of well you can always get _____ instead, but if that really doesn't seem to hold water given that it is in the extremes of temp. There can be considerations made can there not?

Why can't a girl wear a lightweight linen tunic instead of a modern tanktop? Or a sleeveless Roman style linen tunic (no more constricting than a tanktop, but looks much better and only takes a yard of fabric).

Or if she wants to show more skin, a leather bikini top or belly dancer wraparound halter top thingy that I don't know the name of [Ilsa says, 'cholli' - thanks!] (neither is really medieval, but they're solidly established staples in fantasy genres so they're good garb)?

Or a sleeveless dress, or an apron dress without an underdress (you show exactly as much skin as a tanktop, but don't break any rules).

For that matter, you don't have to show skin at all to stay cool - desert tribes are smart, they cover up with fabrics that breathe to keep the sun off. I wear long sleeved wool in the summer partly because it's just as comfortable or more than short sleeves.

And that's not an exhaustive list!

Given that there are many historical and mainstream fantasy ways to stay cool in the heat that work just as well or even better than a tanktop without breaking the rules, why should we feel obligated to allow women to cheat the rules and wear tank tops? I really appreciate the concern that lies behind a desire to cut the girls a break, and I don't want to accidentally discriminate against women by requiring them to conform to a higher standard than the guys, but I don't think that the rules as written do put an unfair burden on women to wear hot, restricting garments while men get to go topless. There are lots of other options that let women stay comfortable without having to set a double-standard.

[Genz]

Just because you're a girl a skirt doesn't make a tank top garb
it's just never garb

Meh this one I don't really see a point of bringing up and really arguing. I can go and fight without a shirt on, or just in general be at an event. A female cannot. If a girl wants to wear a solid color tank top I'm not going to stress over it. Is it garb in a traditional sense? No, but does it fit a niche? Yes. There is always the argument of well you can always get _____ instead, but if that really doesn't seem to hold water given that it is in the extremes of temp. There can be considerations made can there not?

For that matter, you don't have to show skin at all to stay cool - desert tribes are smart, they cover up with fabrics that breathe to keep the sun off.

Given that there are many historical and mainstream fantasy ways to stay cool in the heat that work just as well or even better than a tanktop without breaking the rules, why should we feel obligated to allow women to cheat the rules and wear tank tops? I really appreciate the concern that lies behind a desire to cut the girls a break, and I don't want to accidentally discriminate against women by requiring them to conform to a higher standard than the guys, but I don't think that the rules as written do put an unfair burden on women to wear hot, restricting garments while men get to go topless.

I accept and approve of this statement.

[Kensman Ilariia]

I stay cooler in long sleeve linen more than i ever did in a garbed up bikini top.

Just a point of note,  the SCA actually has lower garb standards than Dag does.  You can legally walk onto a battlefield in jeans and a t-shirt.  It's been done. They just do the peer pressure & leading by example things A LOT better.

And it's Choli

[athelas]

Love choli... just wish I were thin enough to look good in one.

[Kensman Ilariia]

Love choli... just wish I were thin enough to look good in one.

You do.  How about I make one too and we can use them for our walk about?

[Syre Jari Kafghan the Dark Knight]

Just because black doesn't mean it's garb

I don't care how long BH used it as his excuse.

[athelas]

Oh, Brenna and I in choli, with booze, doing a walk-about. Watch out Ragnarok!

[Judge Dredd]

Just because black doesn't mean it's garb

I don't care how long BH used it as his excuse.

Good burn!

[athelas]

Oh, Brenna and I in choli, with booze, doing a walk-about. Watch out Ragnarok!

Now we just need cabana boy volunteers. Where is Stryder when I need him?

[Syre Jari Kafghan the Dark Knight]

I do what I can.

[Kensman Ilariia]

Oh, Brenna and I in choli, with booze, doing a walk-about. Watch out Ragnarok!

Now we just need cabana boy volunteers. Where is Stryder when I need him?

Volunteers?  Pfft.  This is when you Volun-tell!

[athelas]

Hmmmm, I may have a few in mind

[MidnightWolf]

This is another instance of "Poor planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine."

Now that's a motto to frame and hang on the wall!

My dad was a Senior Chief in the Navy and he DID have that motto sitting on his desk.  I can't count how many times he used it on me at home too.

Now...  My kids get to hear it all the time from me.

His phrase was "Lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part".

God Love ya, Stell for knowing my all time favorite phrase.

dude sweet. my dad was a senior chief his was "people that are good at making excuses are seldom good at anything else"

[Gavin Kilgore]

I don't always circlejerk about the same topic for months at a time, but when I do, I like to do it with the same 8 people.

Am I doing it right?

Seriously -- instead of crying in 9000 different posts about garb standards, come up with appropriate solutions at RWC. I check the boards twice a week, and each time, half the posts are the same handful of people crying about the same thing -- probably the reason those handful of people are the only ones who post here.

[Sir Mirelle of Narnia]

I don't always circlejerk about the same topic for months at a time, but when I do, I like to do it with the same 8 people.

Am I doing it right?

Seriously -- instead of crying in 9000 different posts about garb standards, come up with appropriate solutions at RWC. I check the boards twice a week, and each time, half the posts are the same handful of people crying about the same thing -- probably the reason those handful of people are the only ones who post here.

http://www.dagorhir.com/forums/index.php?topic=21004.msg440340#msg440340

[Aisling Iona]

I never exactly made vet garb, I've usually been pretty good at not having crapcrap come up in my gear but from what I'm reading here.... I mean, Yeah, I can understand a few of these things every now and then depending on the circumstances....
I dunno, maybe its because I fight only in the minimal amount I can safely wear for the season.
Summer = Kilt, more likely a pair of draw string pants (Used to be pajama bottoms, gave that up and started making actual garb for myself) Winter = Tons of layers. All my mundane warm and fuzzies is completely under my garb as not to cause a distraction.
Is that so hard? I make maybe 250 a week, and I can still afford to make this stuff. I mean seriously...
I think there are some people who need a good kick in the junk out there...
*rantrantrant*

Anyway, enforcement on the issue is rather very easy; don't have garb, don't get on the field. Most of the chapter battles I've been to do a quick check of garb before the battle starts, and I agree with it. Checking garb as part of check in for a battle wouldn't be that hard, you just need to take a quick look at someone to know if it is or isn't.

[Mikhail]

I don't always circlejerk about the same topic for months at a time, but when I do, I like to do it with the same 8 people.

Am I doing it right?

Lolz.  I bowl overhand.

[Syre Jari Kafghan the Dark Knight]

rage

[Gavin Kilgore]

rage

[Melkore]

Allow me to be the first to say something different. Thanks to everyone who went to Gates and endured the weather to have fun, Consdiering this is nothing but talking about that event, I wanna add my 2 cents on it.

Yes people in pink jump suits doesnt really count as garb, but the hearlds and event staff didnt do much about it.  These are things that NEED to be looked at once people get to the field.  If fighters are checked over at this point you could limit situation like this from happening.  There where many garb issues at Gates, from Pink jump suits, fighters in camo, wearing sun glasses, and several, several fighters in blue jeans.  The examples brought forth where only a couple examples of this.  However, if you took a step back and looked at everyone, the only thing that stood out was a guy who was dressed up like Captain America.

My only issues was how all this was handeled. Putting a Healrds Tunic on to just call people off the field, while you wear fighting cause, "Garb doesnt meet your standard" is wrong.  If this is such a important issue to you. Maybe this is a job you would want to do all the time at a event. The sad thing about work is we cant pick and choose when we should be doing the work and to who.

And you should never tell anyone to willingly "put someone down, anyway you see fit"...just cause they dont meet your standards.

The bottomline is we all are coming together to have fun, we cant loose focus on that, we only hurt the game for everyone.

[Karina]

rage

LIKE

[hivemind]

...excuses...

I wondered how long it was going to be before someone tried to bring the Gates of Summer drama here.

[Kurai]

Can we just go ahead, skip the arguing and keep on with the topic at hand? Because we can do the drama to death, or we can keep going with clarification on garb. I'd really prefer the latter.

[Judge Dredd]

I am working this from the inside out. The hell with yelling and screaming from the mountain tops about wearing better garb. I am discounting garb to the good fighters of this game so they can lead by example. I am in negotiations with Rouge Co.(Olympics tourney winners)  Wolf pack (Aratari war god ect..) and working on getting G2G (won more tourneys than any other unit) garbed up. I want to garb the best of the best. IMHO Garb should be an indicator of battle skill. So next time you roll up on someone in good garb, be afraid, be very afraid!! It's time scrubs looked like scrubs and the top tier fighters looked like top tier fighters.

If you are a badass in this game, please, Croms balls please, dress the part so we know who you are!!

Sorry, back to the GoS drama!!

[Solusar]

Allow me to be the first to say something different. Thanks to everyone who went to Gates and endured the weather to have fun, Consdiering this is nothing but talking about that event, I wanna add my 2 cents on it.

Yes people in pink jump suits doesnt really count as garb, but the hearlds and event staff didnt do much about it.  These are things that NEED to be looked at once people get to the field.  If fighters are checked over at this point you could limit situation like this from happening.  There where many garb issues at Gates, from Pink jump suits, fighters in camo, wearing sun glasses, and several, several fighters in blue jeans.  The examples brought forth where only a couple examples of this.  However, if you took a step back and looked at everyone, the only thing that stood out was a guy who was dressed up like Captain America.

My only issues was how all this was handeled. Putting a Healrds Tunic on to just call people off the field, while you wear fighting cause, "Garb doesnt meet your standard" is wrong.  If this is such a important issue to you. Maybe this is a job you would want to do all the time at a event. The sad thing about work is we cant pick and choose when we should be doing the work and to who.

And you should never tell anyone to willingly "put someone down, anyway you see fit"...just cause they dont meet your standards.

The bottomline is we all are coming together to have fun, we cant loose focus on that, we only hurt the game for everyone.

This actually reads more like a well thought out, mature post about the thread topic. Less like a call for drama.


PS:You can call pushing a dude into a barbed wire fence...twice....drama if you want, I call it something else completely. Gloating about doing it is a whole different beast, but I'm not even trying to get into that.

[Drunken Bob (For Congress)]

...excuses...

I wondered how long it was going to be before someone tried to bring the Gates of Summer drama here.

PS:You can call pushing a dude into a barbed wire fence...twice....drama if you want, I call it something else completely. Gloating about doing it is a whole different beast, but I'm not even trying to get into that.

Not that long.

To me there was no excuse for that. And even though it may not matter, I lost a bit of respect for that person. No matter what the reason, there is no excuse for that sort of action, to purposly try to hurt someone for garb... that is in really poor taste

[Silk]

Melkore, I have to agree with Solusar on the overall tone of your post. Well thought out and mature.
However I do have to disagree with you on the garb herald thing. Even head heralds get to enjoy the fighting for part of the day. No one should have to give up their whole day fighting to do any heralding job. That said, I don't think that Stell was tossing people off willy-nilly nor would she take any heralding action without the approval of the head herald or event staff.

Remember this is an all volunteer thing. If someone is working it's not for pay, it's taking time out of the sport they enjoy to make it better.

[Melkore]

Thank you Silk. I agree with almost everything you said. But sadly that is what happened and it was dealt with the wrong way. I have never had a garb situation that warrented steping of the field putting on a hearlds tunic to remove them from the field. That could have waited tell that game was done.  And the head hearld didn't know what was going on. This was completely handeled poorly.

[Squire Lizard]

Wow... You guys should really grow the **** up. There is NO EXCUSE to throw a fighter into a barbed wire fence and even less excuse to not throw that fighter out if the event.
The people condoning or defending this action are REALLY defending the dignity of this game... 
Come on guys. Lets try putting this game first for once instead of our pride or backing our friends?? Maybe??
And before its said, NO, what happened was not for the betterment of the game. If so, it would have been handled differently by ALL parties involved. There was no honor in what happened, and I am sad for your mothers.

[Soo Ma Tai]

#1. If you are pushing people into barbed wire fences on purpose, you shuold be removed from the field immediately for safety reasons. At no time should a player be intending to harm another player, their equipment or their garb.

#2. The garb police are there to remove people who's garb doesn't meet the minimum requirements set out in the MoA. It's not about who thinks what looks cool or not. It's supposed to be about who has passing garb and who doesn't. Jean...go get dressed. Pink crap, not a crotch length tunic...go get dressed.

[Hundrsut]

....someone was purposly thrown into a barb wire fence and then that person wasnt kicked out?


i am confused

[Olos]

It wasn't a good situation for sure, but maybe hear both sides of the story before passing judgment, mkay?  Something I usually try to do.

Anyway, back to the point of the thread?

[Solusar]

Anyway, back to the point of the thread?

Like that ever happens around here. 

[Dragonwalker]

Point of the thread: If Blackhawk can finally get around to wearing better garb, why are most of us still fighting about it and pretending we look cool?

[athelas]

If we can get the Prez in garb, all will be good.